How Nutrition And Supplementation Play An Important Role In Your Recovery With Special Guest Simon Billings
Welcome to the Back Pain Solutions Podcast – How Nutrition And Supplementation Play An Important Role In Your Recovery With Special Guest Simon Billings
Click here to subscribe via iTunes
If you like the show, we would be grateful if you would consider leaving the show a review on iTunes as well as Stitcher Radio. A couple minutes of your time can help the show immensely! Thank YOU!
Listen To The Episode Below
Episode Introduction
There is a growing group of chiropractors and other practitioners who are stepping outside the narrative of their prescriptive role and embracing a more holistic approach. This seems to be the result of realising the need to assist the patient in different areas, where needed, in order to help them over the tipping point towards healing. This is often needed when patients experience chronic issues which do not resolve with a single pronged approach. Multi-pronged approaches, for this reason, are often a life saver for patients who have not been successfully helped in the past.
Today we interview Simon Billings who graduated from the Anglo-European College of Chiropractic in 2001 and is today a Doctor of Chiropractic at St.James Chiropractic Clinic in South Hampton, England. He has lectured nationally and internationally on the subjects of jaw joint disorders, nutrition and trigenics. He has also published articles on the subjects of migraine, vitamin D deficiency, mis-shapen head syndrome (plagiocephaly) and ankylosing spondylitis. Simon also teaches at the Academy of Chiropractic Nutrition. An organisation which he created with the goal to help chiropractors be more efficient with treating their patients through nutrition and supplementation. He speaks of the metabolic side of health as being overlooked by many chiropractors.
In this episode we discuss the need for proper nutrition and supplementation where needed alongside physical therapies as a way to help patients, otherwise often not helped, towards recovery of their complaints. Quite often the ability of the body to heal is overlooked when only applying physical, hands-on therapies and so in the words of Simon Billings “you are flogging a dead horse”. If the body is not ready to heal, for whatever reason, it will not heal. Stimulating the body from a point where you enable the healing ability by correcting for deficiencies or toxicities becomes the goal and so we set the body up towards getting better.
Some of the things you’ll discover…
- That all the pillars of health needs to be addressed
- The metabolic side of health is probably the most overlooked & poorly treated
- The necessity of vitamin D and how to best get it on sunny days
- Why a multi-pronged approach works better than a single therapy
- How nutrition and supplements may be the missing link your recovery process
- That there is hope for long term chronic issues when fixing underlying problems
- The importance of having a good working diagnosis based on sound findings
Episode Highlights
Increasingly we’re seeing the important role that nutrition plays in the management of chronic diseases but it also extends to musculoskeletal care. If you’re suffering from chronic, persistent pain, and you’re not seeing the improvements you would expect, or desire, then you need to seek additional advice to support your recovery. Healthcare practitioners must realise their own limitations and expand their network to maximise the support they can offer their patients.
GET OUR FREE EBOOK
Start taking control of your back health today! Enter your details below
Episode Transcription
Intro 0:00
When we’re young, we move with freedom and confidence with a great resilience to injury. But somewhere along the line we develop poor habits and become more vulnerable to back pain. Back Pain solutions features evidence based and practical advice to help you take back control of your health and get back to the activities you love. This is your guide to better back health through movement. So join us as we demystify some of the commonly held beliefs about back pain and build your confidence to a stronger back the smartway
Ben James 0:28
Welcome back to the back pain solutions podcast everybody, and in today’s episode, Jacob is joined by a special guest, Simon Billings joins Jacob on the show to discuss all things nutrition. Simon graduated from the AECC back in 2001, and is today a Doctor of Chiropractic at St. James’s chiropractic clinic in Southampton down in the south of England. He’s lectured nationally and internationally on the subject of jaw joint disorders and nutrition and try genetics. And he’s also published articles on the subject of migraine, vitamin D deficiency, misshapen head syndrome, and ankylosing spondylitis, to name a few. Simon also teaches through the Academy of chiropractic nutrition, an organization which he created with the goal to help chiropractors be more efficient with treating their patients through nutrition and supplementation. He speaks of the metabolic side of health as being overlooked by many chiropractors, and no doubt many other health care professionals so sit back and enjoy the show.
Jacob Steyn 1:28
Simon, welcome on the on the podcast and it’s great having you here. So you’re a chiropractor in Southampton, England, not far from where I studied and Ben, we studied together. Where did you do your your chiropractic teaching or your education?
Simon Billings 1:46
Yeah same class in Bournemouth, same as you, I live in Bournemouth work in Southampton. So I’ve qualified in 2001. And then I’ve been in private practice ever since and to do three days as a chiropractor, and then I do two days sort of teaching a little bit nutrition, but also then do a one to one and nutritional consulting over zoom for various sort of, you know, various issues of my own health that sort of led me into the nutritional side of things.
Jacob Steyn 2:17
Yeah, that’s, that’s what I wanted to ask you about. Because I, you know, I’ve been following your newsletters. And you speak up your own experience with autoimmune problems. And I would have liked Actually, I would really like to know how you got into the whole nutritional approach.
Simon Billings 2:34
Yeah,
Jacob Steyn 2:35
Can you can you tell us more.
Simon Billings 2:36
I was always I had an interest in nutrition. In college, I had a member having Patrick Holt with nutrition book. And I was down at the local health food shop, buying things and trying to stop getting colds and things and, and so on and taking supplements. So we had had an interest, but it was you know, didn’t really go much beyond that. And then I qualified and during my so from my sort of late teens into the college years sort of 1920 up to the when I qualified 2324 I got a lot of aches and pains all over my body. And I kind of get I get tendinitis in my shoulder and then tennis elbow on the other side, then the thumb tendinitis in my ankle, then my back would hurt. And then it was moved around a lot. And and then I was doing various things like I’ve had some a skin would start peeling in places for no reason and get acne again. And I have insomnia, and terrible concentration in lectures and so on. Yeah. And so these were I didn’t realize that time is all just warning signs that my health was failing slowly. And then by the time then I hit I think sort of mid No, probably lateish 20s. By that point that I had some x rays taken, I was just really looking at my hips, actually to see if they were normal shape. And if I could see then on the X ray that was one of my pelvic joints had had damage on the X ray. And so and I have a family history of an arthritic condition called ankylosing spondylitis. My brother has that so that I knew what it was. And I knew that he’d taken a very traditional medical route with the medications and less than the other. But you know, it hadn’t probably left him in a great place. And so I didn’t want that for me. And I’d seen lots of patients obviously come in with ankylosing spondylitis that I knew, I knew what it could do to you for sure. So I was pretty motivated. So I by that point, I’d read a little bit more nutrition of it, I dug into the research and written books and read lots of stuff online. And I found an association between your gut microbiome that certain bacteria in the gut one called klebsiella, which is a particular bacteria, and on the surface of this bog there has a sequence of molecules that look very, very, very similar to the collagen in your joints. So if your immune system takes aim at the bacteria and it recognizes it’s overgrown. It shouldn’t be in there in your gut, it will take grain, but your collagen gets its mistaken identity. So attacks me in by mistake. And that was very well established in the research, nothing kind of woowoo It was really well established, but not part of mainstream treatment, per se.
Jacob Steyn 5:22
Yeah, because I mean, I, myself haven’t actually heard of it in such detail as you just explained it now. And and we use we are you specifically speaking of the SI joints are more low back or hip joints?
Simon Billings 5:36
So well, it will as well attack the whole spine pretty much as you know, and other things. But the So for that, yes, it’s it’s particularly so just because your theory is that your guts weren’t drained, the lymphatics were immune system live, they, they drain down into the pelvis. And so the first part of the immune system goes tends to be the sacroiliac joints in your pelvis. And then it will then you know, eventually attack everything on and off. And you frequently see patients with ALS, and it’s the same with rheumatoid they have other bugs, they’re associated with just different different bacteria that, again, look a bit like you. And but they go through flares. So same with most autoimmune diseases and things like MS, you’ll get a real flare with a lot of pain. And then they’ll sort of drop again, they’ll go through as acquiesce in phase and then up again, and there’s a sort of theory that maybe this is part of the life cycle, or the bacteria, that kind of building and building and when they die, they’re released lots of poisonous chemicals as well. And you get these big spikes of inflammation, and autoimmune disease patients often go through. So that was my first bit and I kind of went through a process with that and a lot of testing. I actually spoke to the lead researcher, who had done all this research in the 80s and 90s. And about it and then
Jacob Steyn 6:48
Is that a British English bloke? Yeah.
Yes. Go to Alan Ebringer in London. So he had a London as clinic? No, that was very effective. They had the treatment, I should say this is made it our, our application of this has evolved a great deal because this was in 2000. We’re always seven or eight, maybe, yeah, they just zero start, or at least a very low starch diet with the idea to try and stop feeding the bugs. Yes, yes. Yes. Mix? No, there are pros and cons to that. But um, when we’d have a more nuanced approach now, but at the time, he had a clinic in London, the ALS clinic or at least in the 80s, and 90s. And he had hundreds 1000s of patients in remission, from ankylosing spondylitis with no drugs, or at least some of them far less drugs. Yes. But he got shut down actually is funding. Because so yeah, so for various reasons, I’m sure, potentially, but um, so that was, you know, that was one part of it. And there’s there’s other things that came along after that I didn’t know about as well.
Well, please tell us.
Simon Billings 7:59
So I so I did that for a while and was so successful to a point. And then I then had my wisdom teeth removed on one side. And within I’d say, within two weeks, I had psoriasis. Okay. So that was pretty upsetting in the sense that when I had this inflammatory stuff in my bank, it was my, my little secret that no one else knew about it, and I could hide it and whatnot. I’ll try it, I’ll do things to improve it. But the psoriasis it’s it’s a very different thing. And that didn’t really hurt me, but it was very visible, and on my hands as well as on my legs and body. And so the psychological effect was actually far worse in some ways, because I felt very ashamed about that and got embarrassed at my appearance. So at that point, I went back to the research and I actually saw rum. I saw a dermatologist and she said, Well, psoriasis and you take steroid cream, if that doesn’t work, you do cold tar. That doesn’t work. You know, you’ve got this like a hierarchy of how hardcore the drugs get, yeah, to bring it down. And I just left really upset. I just knew there must be more to it than that, because like they knew about me and the other stuff. And I thought maybe this I hadn’t fully gotten hold of what was going on. And so then I dug back into the research and haven’t had some books around certain areas from the stuff and I dug into that found some reason I found a group of researchers in it was in Tennessee in America, and they had a 50% more than 50% I think complete remission from psoriasis and psoriatic arthritis as well. And they had a protocol they would a protocol of testing for infections, again, bacterial infections, often streptococcus and then also yeast infections. And they had a very quite a basic approach of just very hardcore antibiotics and antifungal medicine, but over 50% remission of, you know, a disease that if you if you look it up online or see a doctor, that’s, you know, say well, you can’t get rid of it.
Jacob Steyn 9:57
It’s incurable exactly like incurable.
Simon Billings 10:00
So that’s where I, I’m feel kind of get a feel I felt really annoyed when I left and even now I still get upset about it because I think there is then again, this isn’t Whoo. They’ve known about infections and psoriasis for, I think, almost 100 years they have people have sore throats a lot. They’ll often get psoriasis afterwards. And they would take people’s tonsils out. And their psoriasis would go away. Yeah. And so he’s a good researcher since the 80s and 90s Publishing data saying if you do this, you can get remission. And yet it was not certainly not in the UK, at least. It was nowhere near any of them. You know, and I paid privacy this this, this consultant, and I met somebody in London as well. So that I feel, I feel, I feel somewhat frustrated and agreed for patients that, you know, we live in. Certainly, you know, evidence based medicine is meant to be a patient centered experience.
Jacob Steyn 10:53
Yes, yes.
Simon Billings 10:54
You take the best evidence, and you take clinical experience and the patient’s wishes. And wants and I feel that it’s not really done half the time, it’s it’s a nice sales pitch, but doesn’t really deliver.
Jacob Steyn 11:05
I would very interesting what you’re saying. And I think you’ve got a very good reason there, at least motivation to do what you do, because of your own experience. I have something similar with my own low back, very heavy hernia I had 10 years ago in the beginning of my career. And, you know, that’s pushed me along the path of really exploring how to get people better when they’ve had a low back hernia, because I, I see so many people who, you know, they’re there, the next step is getting a an operation. Or they’ve had it for a year and a half or two years or longer, and it just doesn’t go away. And, you know, the the not only the frustration, but the hopelessness, what that you see, sometimes in patients when they, you know, they, they’re past the point of frustration, there’s just no more hope it’s, you know, that they’re there. And I tell you, look, I’ve been everywhere. And if you, you’re my last hope, basically, I mean, I’m sure you’ve heard that a few times. And it’s very frustrating for us. And for me when you see that, and, and quite often, you’d get something better in a few weeks. It’s been a chronic problem for a couple of years or more. And it’s just not had the right diagnosis, if not had the right guidance. And I can just think of so many of those examples. But yeah, it’s a nice story, nice hearing about your own experience.
Simon Billings 12:36
I think one of the thing is all of that, you know, I know that not every doctor or every chiropractor or osteopath, whatever is an expert in every area. You can’t be all things to all people, right. But some it also as a professional, you need to be to recognize, well, this thing could be caused by this, this and this. And I do all these bits are not really expert on this. So when I spot it, I’ll give you want the options for treatment, and you want my bit that’s great. If you want nice bits, then you go see someone else and I can give you a recommendation. Yes, they’re not just doing your bit. And not even mentioning. The other stuff, I think is unethical.
Jacob Steyn 13:14
Which is what they get on mainstream media.
Simon Billings 13:18
Yeah, yeah.
Jacob Steyn 13:19
And it’s it’s exactly that, you know, I’m a very functional chiropractor, which means that I get somebody with who’s had a hard hit against the head. And they need to see a new neurological chiropractor. You know, I have my context I send them on and i don’t i already at the at the intake at the first appointment I I explained to them. Well, it’s great that you’re here. But I’d really you know, there’s no charge for today. But I’d really like you to go there. Just because I know that I’ve got a much better chance of it getting better. Yeah. So yeah, that’s the reason why we really wanted to have you on the show because of you know, your approach. And you know, I really like your website, where you, you explain how some patients just won’t get better with traditional chiropractic. And my thing has always been nutrition. And I’m still waiting for the day where I can really go into further study and really, maybe get to a level where where you are at this present moment. I don’t know if I’ll ever reach that point. Because I’m also very caught up and other things. I think you know how it works, you only have that much time. But it’s great to see that there’s this development of or at least awareness of nutrition. And while maybe I’m sort of orthomolecular nutrition supplement base on top of the traditional chiropractic that we do because it is an incredible, powerful, powerful and eh..
Simon Billings 14:54
Yes.
Jacob Steyn 14:55
So I
Simon Billings 14:56
And remember that the we are as a we’re ‘iller’, as people in the West in the West now that we’ve ever been, because of our lifestyle, we know we have a, we have all our genetics and our evolutionary ancestry is hunter gatherers. And we have a very modern lifestyle, and they don’t fit very well. And that’s, you know, from pointing out how much we move, like, people just do a lot of sitting, right. I mean, it’s just constant sittings, that we that doesn’t gel with who we are, and we evolved, as, and the diet that we eat now is very different to anything we evolved to eat, and the levels of pollution that we have, in in society, the stress levels, we have all these things are just bad. And we live a long time, because we have some good medicines to keep us going. But the last 10 years of life often is pretty poor quality. Yeah. And so I think that, you know, from our point of view, when we were training, you heard these amazing stories about sort of holding one like one treatment, and you cure this patient of whatever it was, right? Yeah, that doesn’t really happen anymore. Not not like it did, I don’t think. And I think part of the reason is people are very, they have very low levels of nutrients in their diet, but high levels of toxins coming in. Yeah. And so they’re very inflamed, generally speaking, and very stressed. And this is a, you know, a good platform for people to get injured, and then stay injured, like you say, and not respond in the way that we know that could do with the right sort of internal environment for themselves.
Jacob Steyn 16:32
Yes, very deficient at the same time, to a degree toxic. And if you look at the videos of chiropractors 100 years ago, I mean, I’m sure you’ve watched those videos, maybe as a student, and you see how they did the upper cervical adjustments and, and they just looked at looked like somebody getting killed. Because I had this discussion with, with another chiropractor, you know, like you say, people could just have a lot more back then. Um, South African I grew up in South African I know, from a different lifestyle, people are just a lot stronger than where you would be maybe in Europe, or when I moved to England, I could see that just being so much inside different weather, but also a different different culture where there’s you don’t have to do as much as many physical things like you would in Africa, for example, it’s, it’s, it’s a little bit advanced in that way, but at the same time, it has its cost. And so people, people become weak. And you know, and I think if you would treat patients the same way as they did, chiropractors did 100 years ago, you would have, you’d have a lot of problems. A lot of unwanted problems. So but I think, you know, we have to say that as chiropractors, we we really take care of the way we work, especially when it comes to manipulation. And that’s obviously varied. For the the intensity is very to the person we have, we’re going to treat a very strong young male, very different to an elderly, frail lady. But I’m very curious about your view on vitamin D and how you work with it, what you what you do with it, if you don’t mind?
Simon Billings 18:29
Yeah, so no, we that’s probably the most common thing we, we give out. And again, we just look, look through the lens of evolution. And you made a good point about, you know, if you live in South Africa, then you know, from, from a genetic point of view, you’re going to your skin tone, your melanin content is adapted to the environment and that map sunshine. The problem is that if you are if you are ancestry from somewhere in Africa, and you move north, then there’s a mismatch between your your evolutionary ancestry and where your latitude you live now. So written to those people, you know, in England, people have a black or Asian background are universally deficient. So in the winter, and very commonly low, even in the summer, and even amongst people that are Caucasian, we know that also they’re in the middle of winter that 90% of the population are either deficient or insufficient. And that’s because a combination in the summer when we should be getting sunshine we spend a lot of time indoors, and then we are outdoors. If we get out in you have to be out between about 11 and three or four o’clock in the afternoon for the sun to be strong enough to make this Monday so you can’t make any vitamin D. in England at least from about September/October to around about April you make none on your own at all. No matter how much Sun, the sun is too weak. So good rule of thumb for people listening is that if your shadow is shorter, than you are, yeah, then you will make vitamin D. If it’s longer than you are, the sun is too weak to make any. So shorter than you are good explanation, then you’re okay. Yeah, and that’s generally between about 11 and three ish four ish in the UK between about April and September ish. But you can’t wear lotion, if you want to make vitamin D, because the whole point of the lotion is to block the UVB as the UVB that will generate vitamin D. So we musn’t get burned either. This is very important, because that’s getting burned is one of the best ways you can give it up a melanoma later on in life. So the key thing would be to get depends on your skin tone. So I’m fairly fast or fairly frankly, I don’t need a lot some time. So I’m, if I spend more than sort of half an hour, 45 minutes that I will burn. So you want to aim for about a quarter to a third, no more than a half of the time that you would take to get pink. So you’re not gonna get you know what, that, you want to spend maybe a third of that. And then so if i guess i get burnt in half an hour, for example, I would aim to get 10 minutes in strong song with no lotion. With a good amount of skin out you need at least the very least your arms and legs out and ideally torso didn’t get it. And then once up to 1015 minutes or whatever it is then you lotion up or you cover up when you sit in the shade. What you don’t want to do well I used to do when I was a teenager and holiday was based myself in umbraie Solaire and in layout in the Spanish sun for you know six hours a day, working my way down the suntan lotion, that’s a bad idea because you’re just getting up holed up, and you’ve got lotion on, but you’re still gonna get exposed to it, it’s a bad thing to do. So we need to get the sun when we can, but safely. And then we need to recognize that in the winter, you will become deficient in the UK, certainly. And even Holland.
Jacob Steyn 21:53
Yes, exactly. I mean, it’s the same level. So I think it’s exactly the same with the same Yeah. And and like you say, I mean, people are also in the summer, though, quite often they’re just inside, or they’re in the shade. So they’re hiding from the sun. But our lives have just shifted from, like what I’ve read, and there’s some really interesting, interesting stuff on it, you know, from being hunter gatherers to be nomadic, you’ve been with the animals, until maybe just before the Industrial Revolution, you’ve been outside taking care of the animals. So even in the winter, or before the summer, after the summer, you were outside, where’s where’s now there’s just nothing of that anymore. And, and it’s been become so convenient just to be inside, you have to really make the effort to get outside. And so I think that’s why there’s this almost epidemic of I don’t want to use the word pandemic, epidemic of vitamin D deficiency just everywhere. And then when we look at, okay, so, you know, in the Netherlands, we work on a scale of 50 to 200 milli molar per liter, vitamin D, according to your GP. So at 50, you’ll be you’ll be okay. You know, adequate, adequate, yeah, according to the the GP So, but I will get people in, when I get them to supplement, we usually start first with a test, we either do a test, we get through the post, you know, two drops of blood send it away, or they go to the GP. And then we start supplementing with a boost for a month, and then after month B test again, as as a lot of people are, you know, they are some will take it up very well and others will have a much slower uptake. And then the reaction quite often is Oh, I’ve got a lot more energy. Or I sleep a lot better. Yeah, I feel or I feel a lot better. Yes, definitely. And so then, you know, what I tend to do is try to get them up to 115-125 even 150, you know?
Simon Billings 24:09
Yeah, it’s perfect.
Jacob Steyn 24:10
So your What is your view on that? Now? In a nutshell, what you’re….
Simon Billings 24:15
Yeah, it’s great. So again, we have some research from so your skin will make vitamin D and just to give this is a with the supplements in Holland, what do you know, are they working in international units or micro grams when they buy this?
Jacob Steyn 24:28
There’s a slow shift to micrograms from international units.
Simon Billings 24:32
Okay, so, yeah, yeah, so I’ll do both. But um, so in half an hour of strong sun, your skin can make 10 to 20,000 units of vitamin D. So that’s about I think 250 to 500 micrograms in half an hour because there’s a lot of a lot of vitamin D. So in the UK, the recommended daily allowance is 200 units. So you can make 10/20,000 but they think you 200 is enough and the most people common tablets will have 400 Yes, so and the NHS gives 400. So this is not really a physiologically meaningful dose, well, if you’re deficient, we’ll put that to you and deficiency. But obviously, if you’re not testing, you won’t know that. And therein lies the problem. So when we’re dosing, we want to consider the amount we can make our own ourselves. And the other thing we’ll recommend, remember is that when your skin has made enough, your body, your body will turn the production off. So you can’t become toxic through sun exposure, your body will just turn production down, it’s all good. So then the question would be, how do we know where’s optimal, we don’t want to be just, you know, not deficient or adequate of 51. So we would take a lot of people that work in the sun in a country where it’s hot all year round, and they are outdoors all year round. So for example, lifeguards, say in Israel, or people that were in Costa Rica, in farmers and so on those these people, and then you look at there are Masai warriors, for example, you look at their blood levels, and they usually in the hundreds, maybe the low hundreds, maybe the high hundreds, depending on the person. So that means that endogenously what we can make and when your body has had enough, you know, is optimal level, we would say somewhere in the hundreds. And then we’d also look at the things like associations between cancer levels, and Ms and infections and also, and then look at people’s blood levels and just see what happens. And we’re doing that with COVID a lot the moment, we’re noticing that there’s a trend that the higher your vitamin D is generally the worse the severity of you know, COVID, and there’s a reduction in cancers and MS. And they that’s effect really seems to kick in in the hundreds.
Jacob Steyn 24:51
Okay.
Simon Billings 25:15
So we want to mimic that. I think what you’re doing is spot on.
Jacob Steyn 26:39
And so in the hundreds You mean, when you talk about these people in South America, or maybe the Maasai warriors, hundreds, more than 200? Are we going to three, four or 500? Or?
Simon Billings 26:51
No, no, they’re staying in the hundreds? Yeah, oh, usually sort of low, hundreds to mid hundreds, for the most part, no. So then you won’t get natural production above 200, that wouldn’t generally happen. They do do that in some research for things like Ms, there’s some very, very, very aggressive dosing like 50,000 units a day, way above what you could make. Yeah, and they have some good effects. And there are some genetics involved a little bit the, you know, vitamin D, vitamin D is very unusual in that every single cell in the whole body has a receptor to receive vitamin D. I think the only other molecule that does that is thyroid, very unusual in that respect. So it’s a very powerful thing. And I think what you said there about the energy is really common. And the reason people feel more energy, the reason they sleep better. And the reason they improve their mood is very common as well, is because it brings inflammation down. And if you have inflammation up, you’re tired, you hurt and you’re depressed. Do like a triad pain, brain fatigue, come up again and again. And you know, in our in our practice, you have back pain, and tired and depressed it’s very easy to think that that’s the put them in the biopsychosocial model. You say ah… You’re depressed because you’re tired, your pain, you’re in pain when you’re depressed and blah, blah, blah. But actually, there’s a root cause often, and if you can remove that root, they will perk right up. And then all of a sudden, our chiropractic work works like it ought to.
Jacob Steyn 28:15
Great, great…well explained. Yes. And yeah, with admin D, like you said, Every cell in the body has a vitamin D receptor, and I saw some research on was with rats, looking at the the IVD, intervertebral discs, that is actually influenced, influenced by your vitamin D level. True. And so those are just preliminary, you know, hopefully, they can do something later with people where they look at what that does for your, for your discs. Yeah, but that already says a lot, that every cell has a vitamin D receptor, and I believe the eyes and ovaries have multiple 1000s. Wow. And so with fertility, if you if you’re very low in vitamin D, with females, you know, that’s a big factor.
Simon Billings 29:05
Again, like we said, it’s evolution. If you’re against your natural lifestyle, it will evolve with like, you know, the theory is this is a theory, but it would make sense. If when we migrated from Africa and we went north, over millions of years, there was natural selection that those were the as you go north and you get less sun, there was a natural selection pressure that if your skin is darker, and you got north, the mother who’s vitamin D deficient, the winner of so when you’re a child sorry, in your division, you you get low level rickets and your pelvis is often not an ideal shape. So when you then deliver a baby, they’ll often die in birth and the baby will die. So as you go further north is an advanced and a slightly lighter skin tone and over a period of time. That’s why if you’re originally from North Finland or Norway or something, you are going to be very, very fair genetically speaking and There must be a reason for that. And the we would be that selective evolutionary pressure, lightening the skin tone it because without it, you cannot survive. And that’s why again, there’s a history of things like fermented cod liver oil, tribal people have noticed that certain foods keep them healthy and vital. And the longer term so eating organs, for example, is generally widely practiced by all tribes, people. So if there’s an animal available, they eat it. Yep. And then in your first they just do. So they knew that they have it, but it is what it is. So I know, that’s where one thing with being a vegan, I’ve no problem with it, as long as you’re healthy, I’m good with it. But again, I just from evolutionary point of view, where animals are available, they are eaten, and they are prized for their nutritional content.
Jacob Steyn 30:48
Absolutely. And I think, you know, I just want to add to what you’re saying there, because I’m glad you mentioned that. And that’s also my approach when it comes to nutrition. And, you know, I my main focus is working on basic nutrition. And so, you know, I mean, I think you go a little bit further there in the detail. And that’s great. I focus just on making sure people are getting the nutrients in. So my main focus is just to reduce inflammation, and increase nutrient intake. And from a dietary perspective, the approach that I follow is mainly increased vegetables, a lot increase meat, fish, and chicken. So to make sure that they get the good fats, but also the protein that they need. Because what you see with a lot of people, especially when it comes to chronic fatigue, or just not having energy, is that they really have a lack of basic nutrition. And if you if you focus on that you make that better, you already see that people just get sometimes a lot better.
Simon Billings 31:58
Yeah. And I think some people, isn’t it, just the basic stuff, you have to have good stuff. I need to have less bad stuff. If you do that. Your body generally works better, works better.
Jacob Steyn 32:12
It works better, everything works better. And that’s solid for myself as well also many years ago, and I just I just can’t veer off whatever I do, I just keep coming back as my main thing is my nutrition. And when that works, well. I can train I can I feel good, I can work and it just all streamlines.
Simon Billings 32:34
Yeah, I think one tricky bit I find with patients is that they and I tell them this, I have to say that, you know, the challenge is, you don’t know what normal is. Yes, because you’ve ticked every… you come in with back pain. For example, we’ve also had headaches and migraine and IBS, and depression and anxiety and eczema and asthma. So I know. And I’ve seen your diet, there’s no nutrients in it. It’s just junk food and sugar, and refined flour. And some other stuff. With or without animals, you know that that’s irrelevant, it vegan junk food is still junk food, right? meaty junk food, junk, it’s just junk foods processed. And so they don’t know what not, they don’t know that they’re not meant to have all these things, that they’re all connected with the loss of good nutrients, as you rightly say, and too much inflammation. And totally on the other side, they don’t know what hell’s going on. And that’s where it’s a leap of faith, for them to come with you to take, you know, to change their diet to maybe take some supplements and maybe remove some gluten and dairy from their diet and see if having a reaction then on the other side, like Wow, I didn’t know it was normal to have insert symptoms they didn’t even tell you about. And then like you said, they feel better, they move better, they get that positive. I think breaking the vicious cycle, I find people who have pain, pain, brain and fatigue, if you can break that, because if they’re tired and they hurt, they don’t want to move. And so they they lay around, they get deconditioned they get bigger, they comfort, eat, you know, tie into the food, and then just spiral down into just a terrible condition. And if we can break that some point and get them out and positive and you know, they become educated and take it on themselves, then all of a sudden, you know, it’s there with the team work then not just you dragging them, you know?
Jacob Steyn 34:18
Yes, yes, yes. Yes. I think that that’s where the the art lies is to explain things, we get them on board. And I mean, you know, you know that process, I think you know quite well you just see when somebody steps on to the boat. And then and then we can we can work and we can do it. And that also means that they fully behind what we’re attempting here. Just makes it a little more powerful, especially for their their recovery and healing process. Yeah, I am definitely I yeah, I I think a while ago, I read one of your newsletters and you spoke about Paul Saladino. And you read his book. I mean, I haven’t read his book yet its still on my list, but I’ve listened to him quite a lot. And I find it all very interesting the carnivore diet? And do you have a specific opinion on what you’ve read? Especially if you think of the carnivore diet and its effectiveness.
Simon Billings 35:16
Um, it’s pretty extreme, I think my general point of view is that the ill of the patient is, the more extreme the dietary change will need to be. And that might be a carnivore diet, which for those of you that are no, it is just eating, not just it’s mainly animal based products. So you’d be awfully meat, you might eat some eggs get a lot of fat, often, it’s good genic. He also doesn’t, you know, some berries, maybe some honey as well, is a very, very, in essence, it’s really an extreme elimination diet with a lot of nutrients. That’s really what it is. And is that what you said high nutrient, that’s the cornerstone of the diet, because it teaches high nutrient density with with a high tolerance to the food that come in all food has baggage basically. And meat is useful in the sense that ruminants are grass, grass eating animals, yeah, eat grass, they then chemically transform the nutrients and the vitamins in themselves. So the plant form of vitamin B six is inactive, it doesn’t do anything. And in fact, in plant, it’s bound to another molecule. So they eat it, they then take that molecule off, and they get beat, and then they convert it into the active form that does something. So when you eat an animal, you basically eating concentrated nutrients, they’ve done all the chemical conversion, they put it in tissues, and you then you get the benefit of the activated form in a very easy to get. And it’s high nutrient density, that’s the benefit of eating animals, really. And if you tolerate you know that then you find that’s the difficulty in eating just plants. For some people, genetically, there’s some issues here as well, is that that the nutrients, there’s less nutrients relatively, and they’re in different forms, and often they’re inactive. So this is a subtle nuance there. So I don’t really recommend a named diet per se. I think because I think very much like you I want my patients diet to be sustainable. There’s enough fat diets out there. And the question is, how are you going to maintain it? So it’s kind of what I generally recommend is sort of a modified sort of Mediterranean paleo style. So we emphasize I would like them to be all meat if they will.
Jacob Steyn 37:29
Yes, yes.
Simon Billings 37:31
I’m a nutrient. There is nothing on the planet that comes even close to liver or kidney or you know, that is just it’s unbelievable. Yep. And then they’ll have to eat quality of meats, not just quantity. So maybe some of the Paleo community fall into the trap of eating meat, you know, like, everyday two/three times a day or something because, you know, hunter gatherer ate meat, so that’s fine, but he wouldn’t be there every day. And we want to make sure I’d rather they read me two three times a week, or maybe even more bit less, but did grass fed organic meat is really good quality. Yeah, mix of eggs and some white fish and a little bit oily fish, lots of vegetables in a Mediterranean style. Some vegetarian days do a little bit of fasting. I’m a big fan of intermittent fasting. I do 16/8 fasting Monday to Friday. I find that works really well for me as a lifestyle thing as well in the morning. So for those know, 16/8 is you have 24 hours in a day, you have an eight hour feeding window. So for me, I eat my first meal around 12-1 o’clock, I have all my my food and calories in that eight ish hour window. I’m not militant about it, I’d say finish it say 8 in the evening, I go to bed without having eaten again, I get up and I just don’t eat breakfast. And that makes my morning routine easier. My life less stressful. Yeah. And keeps me lean. And I feel really good in the mornings and then a break my fast about 12 I find that a great way for people to maintain health and also particularly good breakfast is the one they typically have a lot of carbohydrate and sugar is processed for us. So it removes trickiest meal of the day to eat sort of you know, fat and protein.
Jacob Steyn 39:07
Yes. Oh, great. Yeah, what I, my wife had, she still has a gastritis so she had a stomach ulcer very bad when I got to know her. And the only thing that seems to work for her it’s it’s more than 90% better now she almost has no more issues with it, but she has to eat specific times and she has to eat very nutrient dense. So she eats meat three times a day, for example. So she’ll have different types of meat three times a day with purely vegetable and and a great deal of fat. And then the guest writers has really kept aside she has almost no no issues from it anymore. But it’s you know, like in many situations where you have something like gastritis it’s often the multifactorial, so you have, like in her case, you know she has stress or she has deadlines, she has to work hard to become more sensitive to it. And she’s she’s doing a PhD at the moment she’s almost finished but so there’s there’s some pressure. And so but through her diet, she’s managed to really, you know, keep keep really keep it at bay while having no problems with it at all. the only the only allowed we don’t see it as a problem, but the only thing that you have to then pay attention to is planning. Making sure that that you are with go somewhere we were prepared for that or, you know, and she fasting is not an option for her. Whereas for me, similar to what you’re doing, sometimes I’ll skip breakfast, or lunch and I’ll have a dinner. Or sometimes I’ll have breakfast. And I’ll, if I work a little bit longer. until mid afternoon, then I’ll only have dinner. I’ll skip lunch. Yeah, and I get my intermittant and up every now and then I’ll skip a whole day. Yeah, nice. Yes. And, and I’ll just drink some salt water to make sure I get some, some, some salt in my body.
Simon Billings 41:13
I think the important point you brought up there is that you because you are healthy, healthy guy you have metabolic flexibility. So you can do that without, it’s not a big deal. So if you have to eat breakfast, and then a snack at 10, and then lunch and snack at four or you fall apart at the seams, you have a problem with your blood sugar balance. And I definitely used to have that big time. And you’re on this roller coaster up and down, up and down, up and down. That’s not what we want. And lovely to see. You mentioned about Paul Saladino and the carnivore diet and this diet and that diet. I think that’s a really important point in terms of, you know, you want it for me anyway. But for most people this is, the older they are, the more extreme that has to become. But for most people, there’s a midpoint where you want your diets to support your lifestyle, not the diet to become your lifestyle. If you have to make a diet become lifestyle to get better, then that’s fine, as your wife slowly has there. But for the most part, but you want it to be a way to get energy to go off and do the stuff you want to do. Yes, see your friends, and we’re not I can only eat I know raw vegetables or something or I only ever, you know, roll, then that becomes a social problem. And you know, when you travel, it just stressful and people become a little bit, you know, to focused maybe?
Jacob Steyn 42:35
Yes, yes. And I have to, you know, I’m quite passionate about what I eat and about what’s good for you and what’s not good for you. And, and that’s the thing, sometimes, you have to be a little bit careful, I have to judge who I’m dealing with very well, you know, because a lot of people come from a point where there’s so much they can improve. But if you only get them to take a couple of steps forward. First of all, you want them to notice that it actually makes a difference. And then they give you the room to improve a little bit more. But maybe that’s enough. And that’s what they’re willing to do. And that’s great. Yeah, great. Now, well said there about the metabolic metabolic being metabolically flexible, because that’s, and I hope people listening to this. understood that. Because that’s, I think, probably one of the biggest problems we struggle with today is the idea that, you know, oh, yeah, well, I’m having a snack halfway through the morning. I’m having a snack halfway through the afternoon. And that’s that’s just what you know, that’s maybe what the we call it, the fruiting Centrum. That’s what the government advise, you know, have have fruit twice a day and people think is normal that I’m feeling like, I have to have a snack halfway through the morning, or the afternoon. But in actual fact, we should be able to have breakfast, skip a lunch, have dinner, and not really feel hungry. And then we have that we’re metabolically flexible, where we can go the whole day without struggling or feeling like I can eat my arm off. Because I have to, and just function normal.
Simon Billings 44:12
Yeah, that’s great. So I have a question to ask about Holland there because I had a patient who was a pilot from Holland. And he had, I think he used to have bread or toast and then he put sprinkles on it in the morning. And this is a Dutch thing I’m led to is this is a thing in Holland, what’s going on?
Jacob Steyn 44:31
This is a big deal over here. I because I’m South African. I live here for 10 years now. But I can still not call myself Dutch if you know what I mean. So this is an incredibly Dutch thing to do. It’s called hafele slough. And it’s, it’s the sprinkles usually different colors, but depending on if it’s chocolate or white or strawberry. Thank you. really taste the difference. But they they will take bread. Because in the Netherlands they maybe you didn’t know this but we eat more grain because of bread in the Netherlands than any other European country. I didn’t know. Yes, that’s, that’s very interesting. That’s because there’s a lot of a lot of people will have bread for breakfast and lunch standard. So a lot of bread for breakfast, a lot of bread for lunch. And then they’ll put either butter or margarine, and they’ll sprinkle this awful slough. These it’s basically just sugar over the bread. And that’s what they have for breakfast. And I’ve never had it myself. I’ve seen people eat it. But yes, so the very first thing I tried to do when I asked them about their diet is to get them off that. Let’s do that only on the weekend or, you know, that’s not really it’s not really food.
Simon Billings 45:55
But I guess the bread that you have the probably is a more traditional bread than we would have in England, we have very soft, spongy kind of not really bread bread, it’s kind of a highly, highly processed, is it different over there?
Jacob Steyn 46:07
Yes and no? I think generally, it’s the same as in England. As I, you know, I studied in England, I lived there, I know what you’re talking about. But if you really go out of your way, you will find good bread. But I think the mainstream bread that’s being eaten is exactly that soft bread that just never gets old and doesn’t get moldy. And yeah, so I don’t think it’s best. And I tried to explain to people you know, having a swollen belly after a meal, every time you eat is not a good thing. So one of the first steps is to get them off the get them off that amount of grain. Absolutely. Yeah.
Simon Billings 46:55
I guess I’m surprised they’re not fatter in Holland. It’s amazing. So that is it the the genetics because you’re very tall, I felt positively average heights when I came to Holland, for a visit once.
Jacob Steyn 47:05
that could be a reason the fact that people are the tallest nation on the planet. So. And, yes, I think they move a lot. I mean, a lot of them, you know, they go to places by bicycle, whereas in South Africa, you if you have to go around the block, you’ll take the car. And, and here a lot of people, you know, could be a businessman or I don’t know anybody with status, who generally go with a car, they all like to take their bicycle, or at least they have one. That’s it nice that it’s a very good thing. And I know what you mean, in England, people are a little bit more set. They’re a little bit bigger in general.
Unknown Speaker 47:48
Oh, yeah. That has genuinely, with COVID thing. Oh, that’s probably more recognized now that this is this is a big deal. The obesity and the risk of, you know, ending up in in ICU and dying. If you’re a properly obese it’s way, way higher. And unfortunately, over since we had locked down to April, March last year, the average person I think was put on a stone and a half, maybe one or two stones is not uncommon. Now what put on two stones?
Jacob Steyn 48:23
How many kilograms?
Simon Billings 48:26
What is that? maybe two or three kilograms? 100. And sure enough, like you would notice, okay, and that’s a lack of action or lack of movement, and a lot of alcohol.
Jacob Steyn 48:35
Right? How many stone are you?
Simon Billings 48:38
I am about 11 and a half 12 about 75 kilograms?
Jacob Steyn 48:44
75 kilograms. Okay, so that’s roughly it’s like, five or six kilograms per stone, no more seven? Maybe it’s gonna be about five and a half to six kilograms. Notice, that’s, that’s a lot of kilograms in Yes. Absolutely. You know, I’ve, we’ve seen it here. People are talking about it, you know, people gained a lot of weight just because of not moving enough because of the COVID situation. And what goes through my mind is, you know, if you think of the tipping point, the pro, pro inflammatory cytokines and the anti inflammatory cytokines, you know, and you think of the cytokine storm, where’s the tipping, where’s the tipping point for people who’s now gained enough weight, so they become vulnerable to the COVID virus? As that’s, obesity is the biggest reason or the biggest underlying factor.
Simon Billings 49:39
No doubt, no doubt at all. And the same with a with diabetes. They’re often obese obviously, but diabetes is a very, very pro inflammatory state. Same thing and one of the tragedies is at the beginning of the the lockdown in the UK, there’s a cardiologist called aseem altura who is brilliant at he said, you know, you can reverse diabetes in three months. If you do a hardcore, you’re no longer diabetic, we have an opportunity here. This before anything about vaccines or anything was in April, I think it was, by the end of this up, we could have the nation in a really good place. If we go for it, that will bring down the numbers dying and in ICU massively, yeah.
Jacob Steyn 50:20
It was just thinking oh…, what was the outcome of that?
Simon Billings 50:26
Not so much when we when we got fatter so the opposite.
Jacob Steyn 50:30
Yeah, I think I saw something about Boris Johnson saying something about move more, you know, and whether you like him or not, I mean, nowhere else that a leader leader speak of moving more or taking better care of your health. And that’s, that’s what…
Simon Billings 50:47
He was very poorly, you know, I in intensive care. So and he put on a lot of weight. And he was the first as a, I got a bit fat. And he used to cycle everywhere when he was mayor of London, and then he would be also cycling. And he just got bigger and bigger. So he I think he recognized that his own role in that. But obviously, from a media point of view, a politician saying, He’s not saying this, but the media will interpret him saying, you don’t need to lose weight. That’s kind of a fat shaming and saying it’s your fault that you’ve got COVID. He’s not saying that, obviously. I mean unless you’re very careful in what you say, you’re going to get in trouble. Yes, because I, I’m just so surprised that there was nothing mentioned about vitamin D, you know, increase vitamin D do things to to make yourself more resilient to this virus. And nowhere I asked somebody that I know who’s high up in the organization that dealt with how to take on the situation. And I asked him about vitamin D, and you just told me straight, he said, No, there’s no way that the government would give any advice in on taking more vitamin D or increase your vitamin D level levels, because it’s a fat soluble vitamin, and it can build up and it can become toxic. Yeah. And I was thinking to myself, well, you know, to write, but at the same time, I think something, I don’t know the numbers, but 60, or 70% of the country is deficient in vitamin D. So yeah, so at the same time, you know, if you have a national approach to getting everybody’s vitamin D level up to get a higher, you can say, okay, go to GP, you know, I mean, obviously, people aren’t paying for that, get it tested. And we do this properly, so we can try to avoid any complications.
Well in the UK has been mentioned, it was mentioned earlier shown that vitamin D is very important for your immune system, we have some good research to back up, there is some research there that you get less infections, respiratory infections, with the high levels of vitamin D and intervention stuff. And then very quickly, they were saying, the people that are getting really ill seem to be very low. Now, you know, we don’t start at 100% know whether that is association or causation, right. But there is now a lot of research to back up the fact that if you’re low on it, you are going to have a harder time. And if you give them a mega dose at the beginning, and then straight out a various point in their recovery, they are far less likely to die like 60%. In a recent study. Yeah. Now, so that we it is being mentioned the media here a lot. And there’s been a bit there was a lot of researchers put together a paper and it’s kind of a open letter to the world basically saying, Come on. And I think one of the issues the government had is nice for the UK did a review the government body. And they seem quite at pains to say, this is not a cure for COVID. And I think I understand what they’re saying. But it’s a more nuanced conversation than that. Yeah, we’re not trying to find a cure. We’re saying, Well, listen, we know that in the middle of winter 87% of the UK are either deficient or insufficient. That’s a real epidemic. Right. And we have good evidence to say that also, I also say that people that are dying, the most in England are elderly, obese people and black and Asian groups. They’re all 100% deficient or insufficient because of the skin tone, because obese people are lower, and when you’re elderly, you make less. So when we know who’s dying, and we know they’re all deficient. And it’s a hormone, really bitman is a hormone we know they should have good levels of it. Why would you if you haven’t got perfect research, why would you leave them deficient? For me this is because it’s not a drug. And this is where I think the regulators and the government’s got the knickers in a twist, that choosing vitamin D which is the naturally produced hormone like a drug. Drugs are inherently have a danger. If you get it wrong, you can really hurt people. I understand that you need to be careful. It isn’t a drug, it’s overwhelmingly say it is dirt cheap. And we know the people that are dying and low in it. So without purpose, I would just say, just give everyone a good dose. And this goes back to the point made earlier, our government did actually say we’d recommend everyone take 400 units. But that isn’t enough. If you’re obese, or elderly, or dark skinned, you need really probably 4000 would be a good level for most people to start out, then we might see something happen, and I don’t see any downsides. They’re not saying, hey, it’s a cure. Yeah, we can say you’re deficient, we can say we can bring it out. And there’s a good body of evidence to say that it’s good for infections, and there’s some research say that it might help with COVID. We can’t be sure, but there’s no downside. So let’s go ahead and do it. I have no idea why you wouldn’t do that. It just blows my mind. And I feel uncomfortable, ethically, that they haven’t done it.
Jacob Steyn 55:52
Yeah, this is such a strong correlation between the groups that you mentioned, who’s low, and who’s also suffering from the COVID is such a strong correlation. And I remember myself, even when I was living in England, being a student I, I mean, you know, I tried to take care of my health, but as a student, I mean, you get a lot wrong. And I definitely didn’t look at my vitamin D levels. And I came from South Africa always feeling on top of the world, you know, and the winters and not getting sun and being inside it. I mean, I can I with a lot of certainty, I can say that, it must have been a big reason why I had been almost call it depression, where I was feeling really, really low, for weeks on end. And since we’ve, since I’ve been busy with this, and also my wife. Yeah, I mean, I go through the winters just feeling strong and feeling good. And of course, when you get ill, you’re going to you take a little dip, but it’s it’s, it’s not a mental low that I used to have constantly. And, and then in the Netherlands, the the GPS are, I’ve had a lot because I test a lot of my patients, I get to get them tested for vitamin D, kind of standard, and every now and then it will leak out to the to the doctor of the patient of mine. What I’m doing, or you know, they’ll check with a doctor, because they’ve been at Dr. Jacob, the chiropractor wants them to do this, you know, and then I’ll get I’ll get very upset patient back, where the doctors told them that this is absurd, you know, it’s crazy. You can never take those doses. And then I’ll do the same thing as what you explained earlier. I mean, if you in the sun for an hour, fully exposed, if you would be two hours, the sun completely naked. In the middle of the summer, if your skin is able to handle that you’ll make between 20 and 40,000. I use and, and they were like, Oh, really? Okay. Is that possible? I’m sorry. Yeah, well, compared to the 200 or 400 international units, that you’re being advice from the doctor, when you’ve had maybe 20, or even lower out of 200 a very low level, and then explain to them that, you know, that’s not going to do the trick. It’s, it’s, it’s it doesn’t work. So, and then they get back on track. And they like they’re, they’re open for advice. And they’re like, Okay, let’s do this. But it’s, it really is being treated in the Netherlands by the medical profession, like, like a drug, like something that’s incredibly dangerous. And yeah, you know, it’s it’s almost sometimes I have to like, rethink Am I am I still you know, I got it, right? Because you’ve got such an opposing view over there, on how to approach this. And I’m just wondering, do you use vitamin K too, with the vitamin D? What’s your opinion on that? I?
Simon Billings 59:01
Really Yes. What will we give out? Yeah, it’s a combined formula. So it’ll be vitamin D with some kaitou in there. Yeah, you did. You know, it’s hard to know, the rim really got a really reliable test for K two. And you can get k two from eating. So your dark leafy greens, like kale have lots of vitamin K one in it, and you can convert some k one and K two. And if you have a good microbiome was good bugs, they will produce some kaitou for you as well. And if you’re eating dairy, if you tolerate dairy fine, and if the animals are grass fed, so you have good quality grass fed butter that has some kaitou in it as well. So I know that everybody definitely needs it. But the potential downside in the longer term issue might be that if you’re absorbing calcium maximally the vitamin K, it basically turns the protein in your bones on and it sucks calcium into the bone. So it’s very good for bone density. Longer term. So the danger might be you’re absorbing lots of calcium or having the women D. But without that if you’re low in vitamin K to for whatever reason that calcium won’t go into the bones and it can then potentially end up in the arteries and there’s some inverse relationship between osteoporosis and heart disease. So you have to be a little bit careful maybe the longer term with that. Yeah.
Jacob Steyn 1:00:20
Very good. Great. And I’m just wondering, do you want to say something about the academy for chiropractic nutrition? I mean, that’s your, your thing.
Simon Billings 1:00:29
Yeah so its for real practitioners. Yes, if you’re a chiropractor and osteopath, physio, then this is called the Academy of chiropractic nutrition calm, but obviously, it’s we have lots of osteopaths on board and physios just because I’m a chiropractor, that’s going to start it for chiropractors. So it’s it’s kind of my journey where I did lots of functional medicine and nutrition. But at a full on end, it’s very difficult to take that information and put it into a, a neuromechanical Cairo situation, it’s quite hard to integrate it. So I kind of synthesized it down and made it a bit more applicable. And I think the key thing we kind of we talked about vitamin D, and di is that there is sort of an 80/20 thing, there are certain things that are we we call them key stones, or bottlenecks to pain. So something that will hold the system to get in vitamin D is a great example, if you’re low in vitamin D really low under 25 or something, it doesn’t matter what else you do, you will not get better. It is so profound, because the inflammation and the pain, all that stuff, it doesn’t it’s such a mismatch of evolution, you could give them a perfect diagnosis, I think it just will not get better. So it’s a bottleneck change. So if we can get hold of those bottlenecks, like vitamin D, one, b 12, B, another one magnesium, other things, and the diets that we talked about, if you can get hold of those and put that into a sort of a, for a phased approach with it for the practitioners, and then it you get great results with your chiropractic, and then you get a lot of accessory benefits for the patient, you know, they feel a lot better, as well. So that’s for practitioners. They could just Academy of chiropractic calm, and there’s a course. I offer the course up on and off. And then there’s the newsletter, which comes out Fridays at five, with sort of, you know, nutritional tidbits, thoughts, you know, ideas, research reviews, that kind of stuff.
Jacob Steyn 1:02:23
I enjoy those. Great and Ben as well in his non presence. So, yeah, that’s great. I think we’ll stop here Simon, it’s been great talking to you. I think that there’s there’s a lot of things we do quite similar and, you know, so it’s always great to hear someone who kind of looks at certain things in the same way to to hear how they, how they do things because there’s those little differences that you’re like, aha, okay. Yeah, that’s very interesting. That’s great. So it’s been a real pleasure talking to you and having you on the show. And thank you
Simon Billings 1:03:00
All the best thank you for having me.
Transcribed by https://otter.ai